Oh no! Fake Patch Alert...

lisu

Bench Warmer
I won a card on Ebay -

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...MEWN:IT&viewitem=&item=230148693632&rd=1&rd=1

And I had an urgent message from someone on BMB telling me to call him quick. I called him, and he told me that the patch is fake. Someone on BMB kept track of all the Ovechkin and Crosby's auto patches from the Cup, and saw that this one is numbered 9/99 and has an altered patch.

Eep. What do I do? I obviously haven't paid yet.
 

Seahawcla

Bench Warmer
Id contact ebay, and UD with the scans of the original and the altered. Then I would look into contacting the seller with the same and saying you are not going to pay for an altered card. But I would only do the seller if UD/ebay dont get you out.

Id take the neg rather then pay that much for a damaged card.
 

metallikat87

Bench Warmer
i dont have newfies email but hes the guy to talk to
he has contacts that can get fakes removed from ebay and i would bet those same people could help you
i assume they would want to see the evidence that it is fake before they punish they guy though
 

lisu

Bench Warmer
Here's a higher resolution scan of the card:

OvechkinFake.jpg


In my e-mail, it shows as definitely 9/99 - not sure if you can see that in this scan.

Here's the original card.

http://s24.photobucket.com/albums/c...rchive/Ovechkin/?action=view&current=0999.jpg
 

sliqwill

Prospect
Transactions: 1
ask the guy what the card # is to be sure, i didnt zoom in or anything, but first id make sure that indeed it is the altered patch
 

lisu

Bench Warmer
ask the guy what the card # is to be sure, i didnt zoom in or anything, but first id make sure that indeed it is the altered patch

in the zoomed in version, the serial number is 9/99. I wonder if I should e-mail Chris Carlin and see if he can assist.
 

ernieren

Prospect
Transactions: 1
I hate Jerks like that . They have to ruin a card for a few extra bucks . just show him the proof and don't Pay . if you get a neg contact ebay and i would think they would remove it with your proof .
 

Krusin

retired hippie
If you know it's not real, no way can you pay. Your gonna have to explain what you've learned & when you learned it. Hopefully the seller will settle for a NPB filing so he can get back his fee's & hopefully you can take an NPB. I would say get E-Bay involved but that's like talking to a block wall. Let the seller know you have evidence that would hold up in court if they want to go that route.
 
N

newfie

Guest
Don't email Chris Carlin, as he wouldn't know a $3 bill is not legit.
Sorry had to get that in, that guy gave his approval of a tampered jersey card one time, and accused me of being ignorant when it came to the card in question and the hobby as a whole. This was all stated before I showed him a clear scan of the original unaltered jersey card and the new tampered patch card. Never heard a peep out of him again.

Anyway, you just need to forward this information you have shown above to the Fraud Investigation Team at UD: FIT@upperdeck.com

They may have made a database of the set, although not likely. If you are able to show clear scans of both, where the serial # is visible in both, or at least the 2 autograph's are clear enough to tell they are identical in every aspect. I have to be honest the autograph in the auction you won the scan is not very clear, due to it being a faraway shot. It would be hard to say the 2 cards have identical auto's.

If you could get the seller to send you a closer shot of the card, this would make things a lot easier. This of course is the tricky part. You have to hope the seller doesn't get pissed off at your request and then slap a negative on you.

If UD does decide with your evidence that card has indeed been tampered with, they will have the auction removed from Ebay's database, and you and the seller will have no way to leave feedback.
 

lisu

Bench Warmer
Don't email Chris Carlin, as he wouldn't know a $3 bill is not legit.
Sorry had to get that in, that guy gave his approval of a tampered jersey card one time, and accused me of being ignorant when it came to the card in question and the hobby as a whole. This was all stated before I showed him a clear scan of the original unaltered jersey card and the new tampered patch card. Never heard a peep out of him again.

Anyway, you just need to forward this information you have shown above to the Fraud Investigation Team at UD: FIT@upperdeck.com

They may have made a database of the set, although not likely. If you are able to show clear scans of both, where the serial # is visible in both, or at least the 2 autograph's are clear enough to tell they are identical in every aspect. I have to be honest the autograph in the auction you won the scan is not very clear, due to it being a faraway shot. It would be hard to say the 2 cards have identical auto's.

If you could get the seller to send you a closer shot of the card, this would make things a lot easier. This of course is the tricky part. You have to hope the seller doesn't get pissed off at your request and then slap a negative on you.

If UD does decide with your evidence that card has indeed been tampered with, they will have the auction removed from Ebay's database, and you and the seller will have no way to leave feedback.

OK, this is what I have discovered since that time. I have e-mailed both Karvin and Chris Carlin and received responses from both. Chris said that it's possible that it was a replacement card and to get the original owner's name so that they can verify it on their site, so I have asked the seller that. The seller stated that the card is on consignment, and the original owner did send it in for a replacement. I asked him for the original owner's name.

Karvin believes that the card is altered because the serial number is the same. I do have a higher resolution scan of the card which I sent to both Karvin and Chris.

Thanks for the e-mail address. I forwarded the link and high resolution scan to that e-mail that you provided.
 
N

newfie

Guest
If UD had replaced the card both the signature and patch would not be identical, as they would have used an extra patch card that had been autographed by the player, and there would be no serial # on it yet. This way if UD needed to replace one for someone, they would just replace it with the blank one and have the same serial # put on it that was on the damaged one. UD has done this with a few SPA's. I discovered this when I databased 2 SPA cards of the same player with the exact same serial #, but each had a different patch and autograph. When I asked how this could be, as I thought it might be a "quality control" error where 2 cards with the same serial # were packed out. They then explained to me what they now do with high end replacement auto/patch cards.

Karvin may be thinking back to the days when they would just send out a replacement that had a different serial #, a different patch, and autograph altogether.

Lisa do you have a clear scan of the current card that you bought yet? If so that will be the smoking gun in this case?
 

lisu

Bench Warmer
If UD had replaced the card both the signature and patch would not be identical, as they would have used an extra patch card that had been autographed by the player, and there would be no serial # on it yet. This way if UD needed to replace one for someone, they would just replace it with the blank one and have the same serial # put on it that was on the damaged one. UD has done this with a few SPA's. I discovered this when I databased 2 SPA cards of the same player with the exact same serial #, but each had a different patch and autograph. When I asked how this could be, as I thought it might be a "quality control" error where 2 cards with the same serial # were packed out. They then explained to me what they now do with high end replacement auto/patch cards.

Karvin may be thinking back to the days when they would just send out a replacement that had a different serial #, a different patch, and autograph altogether.

Lisa do you have a clear scan of the current card that you bought yet? If so that will be the smoking gun in this case?

Yes, I do. PM me your e-mail, and I"ll e-mail it to you.
 

lisu

Bench Warmer
Also, I have been discussing it with the seller. He is selling it from someone. And his story actually rings true. The person he's selling it from bought it from a dealer who bragged about getting the original card replaced by UD.
 
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